Wednesday, August 06, 2008

SNP BROKEN PROMISES AND THE "LOCO INCOME TAX"

The SNP in Renfrewshire are letting people down badly, as are the Scottish SNP Government. In Renfrewshire we have seen cruel and devastating cuts in Education, Social Work, Libraries, Nurseries etc. while Salmond (the spiv) and his camp followers have done no better in Holyrood.

Several eye catching policies helped them to win a narrow victory, how ironic that these promises turned out to be lies. i.e. the cruel lie to young people who said let’s vote SNP and they will give us a grant of £2,00 to put a deposit on a house, the promise is now classed as a “long term policy” no explanation of “long term” is forthcoming so those young couples have been conned by the ’spiv’ callous or what?

Promises on class size reductions turned to dust as well and are now in that same file called “long term policies” schools will just have to lump it, a cruel deception, no class size reductions, until when ? who knows.
Stratchclyde Police are operating with considerably less numbers despite the promise of a 1,00 increase in numbers, the Police should consider arresting the ’spiv’ on charges of deception and dishonesty, they know the SNP have 'previous'

Free bus travel for pensioners has been a great Labour success. They refuse to confirm or deny that it is under threat, more callous deception from the ’spiv’ who gives the usual “definite maybe” when asked.
He might, as Wendy Alexander memorably said be the man who does actually “shove yer granny aff the bus”

I wonder what the implications would be if this concession were scrapped or reduced, who would be the losers ? the elderly, the vulnerable, any winners ? well if you are a bus operator you will see an increase in money paying customers so, that could make some people winners, any guesses ?

What do the following have in common ?

The Institute of Directors - Unison - The STUC - CBI Scotland - The Policy Institute - The Chartered Institute of Public Finance and Accountancy - The Federation of Small Business - Glasgow City Council - The National Union of Students - Edinburgh Chamber of Commerce - The Institute of Chartered Accounts of Scotland.

They are some of the bodies who think the “Local Income Tax” is a “no brainer” the ‘spiv’ knows better apparently. This tax will damage services and the economy but, we will have to suffer because of the ‘spivs’ arrogance before we can get rid of it. The Futures Trust is another squalid stunt, it’s the same as PPP with a different name it’s a re-brand, they must think Scots. are daft. The rest of Scotland is suffering as well as Renfrewshire but that is little consolation, this is the reality of the SNP and their leader Alex (the spiv) Salmond.

48 comments:

Anonymous said...

You forgot to mention the amount of votes they got from people when they promised to wipe out student debt. One of their biggest lies surely?

Anonymous said...

Wur all doomed ............ God you are a happy chappy. Please just go away and leave us happy folk alone. Alex is doing great job unlike the Labour losers.

Anonymous said...

No wonder you got well and truely beaten in Glasgow East. No one believes this rubbish !

Shug Niggurath said...

I'd certainly agree that the SNP local tax plans are little more than a stunt and a way of having the public get used to the parliament having tax raising powers (makes it seem more powerful).

Why they couldn't have tried the other option and actually cut the basic rate of tax given the budget surpluses of recent times escapes me.

Lets face it, if English people seen that the Scots were enjoying free prescriptions AND paying tuppence less in taxes, it would have certainly played better into their plans.

So you have to ask, which party was it who created the conditions for this to happen?

It was yours Terry, the party who brought in devolution with such a convoluted way of electing members and so many members that they calculated the block vote they have would guarantee them eternal power in Scotland.

So this is all a consequence of labour policy and ironically the cause of so much nationalist sentiment. Scottish Nationalism used to run pretty much to hating English sports commentary in general and Motson and Hill specifically. Now people are beginning to hate government too.

Which party caused that?

Anonymous said...

Labour is out of touch, increasing taxes and failing to cut
fuel costs. People in Renfrewshire and across Scotland are suffering as energy bills and petrol prices rise. Yet Labour are completely immobilised. At a time of
real need, Labour are posted missing in every sense. At a time when the Prime Minister is raking in billions of pounds from an off shore windfall he refuses to take the measures needed to bring relief to hard pressed families and businesses. Instead he increases their tax bill by cutting the 10 pence tax rate and refuses to give Scotland a fair share of our own oil wealth, a share that would give the Scottish people direct and
long term benefits.

Compared to this out of touch attitude from the Labour Government, the
SNP Government in Scotland has taken decisive action to help people and the economy.

Among the measures the SNP have taken in government over the past
year are - frozen the Council Tax, begun the phased abolition of
prescription charges, slashed business rates, installed a record number of
free central heating installations, and restored free education.

Anonymous said...

There is no doubt that the Council Tax is unfair, unjust, and hated by 88% of the people of Scotland; the SNP’s decision to freeze it was warmly welcomed by everyone, well, not by their opponents certainly, and they are cooking up a scare with all and sundry.

The policy is based on the firm belief that each should pay according to their means, and is based on income subject to pay as you earn, and this will make it easier to collect. (We also need the £400 million of Council Tax benefit that greedy Westminster wants to hold on to.) It is not suitable for people who live on money received from investments only, but there are not all that many of them in Scotland. The vast majority of people living on investments in the United Kingdom are in the City of London; this is the biggest and best tax haven in the world, where billionaires pay no tax while their cleaning ladies do. This is not a facetious comment, but fact, and the Labour government struggles on trying to reconcile the principles of socialism with their treatment of the non domiciled – well, no they don’t, as any concept of socialism left New Labour many years ago. They are critical of Scots who live on savings, but not on filthy rich foreigners, some of whose source of wealth might be questionable

One other point being deliberately obfuscated by the London parties, is that while Income Tax in Scotland will rise, there will be NO COUNCIL TAX!

I also cannot see what makes the collection so complicated; every payroll system has all sorts of additions, SAYE, charities, union dues, Sports and Social funds, private health etc, so a minor tweak should be all that is required. Tax tables for Scotland can be easily printed for smaller businesses.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 06/08/08
The list is big and growing, we seem to be getting at least one a day , today it was broken promises to farmers.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 06/08/08
Lie after lie and con after con and not one Nat. with the courage to speak up, not one, not even on the abandonment of independence “bring it on” what a bunch of Quislings.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 06/08/08
A master analyst, have you thought about a career on News night ?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Shug Niggurath) 06/08/08
Free prescriptions is a stunt, those who need them were already getting them. Taxes should be rising not falling, people like you who are so obsessed with low taxes have made tax rises dangerous for all parties. We need to grasp that nettle, hospitals and schools have to be paid for, fair and progressive taxation is the only genuine and lasting way to progress.

Devolution was a huge mistake and Holyrood is a farce (think about the SSP) but we are now stuck with it.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 06/08/08
As long as there are people like you around Salmond (the spiv) has the chance of getting away with it, what will it take for you to see it, does the ‘spiv’ have to thump you over the head and shout in you ear “I’m a liar and a con man”

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 06/08/08

Did it need all this to say that it’s a grand conspiracy, all these bodies have put aside their differences to get at the SNP - you people are beginning to unwrap.

Nick said...

Ahoy! Although the SNP may not be delivering on all their manifesto commitments, has Salmond ever had to have his personal barrister say the following in front of a public court?

"Manifesto pledges are not subject to legitimate expectation."

Indeed not, that'd be our current Prime Minister! Yep, Gordon Brown had his legal representative tell Brighton County Court that, effectively, voters shouldn't expect anything promised in a manifesto to actually be delivered once Labour are in power.

In the interests of transparency, this was in relation to a case brought by a member of UKIP over the promise of a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty. Whether or not you think UKIP are right-wing scumbags, it's quite the brass-neck to come out with that line when challenged, eh?

Anonymous said...

When can we expect a post on the gun toting Cllr Kalashnikov Terry?

Rumbold said...

Terry:

I never really understood you until I was watching an episode of ‘Minder’ the other day. Then I realised you believe yourself to be Terry McCann (the first name, the references to boxing, strong exterior but heart of gold). In your world, Arthur Daley is of course the spiv, Alex Salmond (both live on your manor (Scotland), are out for themselves, and are fundamentally untrustworthy). The forces of reaction and the right are personified in Sergeant Chisholm, who is an amalgamation of Thatcher, Churchill, George W. Bush and Israel. Only Dave, the friendly barman, is on your side (and he is an avatar of Stalin, Mao, Castro and all your other pinups).

Anonymous said...

Terry,

i just dont know why you are not leader of your group. you clearly have the highest standards of morality, greatest principles and deepest intellect. Whats wrong with those people.

Dont they know great leader when they see one? I think if Kim Jong-IL sung can make it in north Korea surely you can in the peoples socialist republic of Paisley

Macnasty said...

Another one for The Disaster that is Labour.

Repossessions are at their highest level for twelve years.

Councillor, your Party are now officially responsible for making more ordinary people homeless than the Tories ever did.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 08/08/08

Are you saying that a failure to deliver on a manifesto promise should be against the law ? Are you some kind of Nazi or something ?

If someone fails to deliver you get to remember that at election time.

I’m OK with that and we will remind people at election time. Perhaps you could have found a better example, unless you are in favour of UKIP that is.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 08/08/08
If Bush can make it in America, Nixon, Reagan. Thatcher etc. in Britain.

Anyway I didn’t stand and the leader is doing a fine job exposing this bunch of incompetent cowardly administration who jump when senior officers tell them, 16.7 % pay rise = £11,600 Yr. of a rise for someone already on approx. £100,000 that’s what the SNP Lib./Dem. Cabal have awarded while low paid staff get less than inflation and have to rely on benefits, that’s the reality of the SNP/Lib. Dems.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Macnasty) 08/08/08

The Labour party is responsible for housing more people than any other party in British History.

I accept that you are limited but try thinking about the USA where the housing situation has been in crisis for years under an extreme right wing Govt. maybe that’s labour’s fault as well, look up the word Capitalism and don’t make such a fool of yourself.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Rumbold) 08/08/08
Terry - yes - boxing - yes - Heart of gold - yes - Arthur n Alex - yes - my manor - yes - out for themselves - yes - untrustworthy - yes.

Sergeant Chisholm is a benevolent old uncle who tut tuts at Arfur’s schemes Dave the barman likewise.

Very Good though, if I knew you a bit better I would try something similar say the Ewings of Southfork e.g.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 08/08/08

I’m making the bullets.

Why have you ignored the vast sums of money which the ‘spiv’ has directed to the Muslim project which is headed up by an SNP Muslim Westminster candidate while the other Muslim groups get hee haw ?

Anonymous said...

Terry dear boy,

Did the ex labour controlled council never give 'massive' pay rises to the senior people in Renfrewshire council when they were in charge?

Do i need to ask the council, or are you going to tell us what you bumped up the chief executive and his cohorts dosh when you were in charge.

Or is that going to be another bit of convenient memory loss

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 18:39

At a time when council workers are told that the council can’t afford an award in line with inflation they award their senior officers an obscene amount.

Go and ask who you want, see if you can find a precedent for this. Some people and you are clearly one of them can justify anything no matter how crass it is, it’s an SNP trait.

Nick said...

A Nazi? Come again? Can you substantiate that slur, please?

I can't find a better example of Brown's personal lawyer telling a court that people shouldn't expect manifestos to actually mean anything because that's the only time any one's had the utter cheek to come right out and say it in such bald terms.

My point was this: if manifesto promises aren't important, they're just another piece of marketing flim-flam. Yes, we can vote a party out in the next election, but they come around every four to five years on a national level. That's a long time to have to wait to punish someone for reneging on a promise you took seriously, and the damage may already be done.

With the example of the Lisbon Treaty, once we ratify it it will bind us into a continent-wide system of governance, taxation and law that it would be incredibly hard to withdraw from it. If I were Euro-sceptic, what use will my vote be then?

The same would go for the SNP's tax pledges: if they aren't delivered, the people who voted for them may suffer materially. All an election in five years would allow them to do is mete out punitive votes.

I don't think that's entirely healthy for our democracy: political parties should be judged on what they do rather than what they don't do. If I vote for a party, I want them to do what they say they will. Then, come the next election, we can all vote according to our opinion of the efficacy of their policies.

I don't support UKIP. I'm broadly in favour of more involvement with Europe. In fact, I mentioned that the legal case involved UKIP so you wouldn't accuse me of being some sort of right-wing fifth columnist - note the qualification at the end of the post.

Apologies for length, but when someone implies I'm a Nazi I feel I should answer them as completely as possible.

Anonymous said...

"Terry - yes - boxing"

PAH! The only boxing you've ever done is boxing Arbroath smokies.

Although as that would entail being in areal job, I sincerely doubt you've ever done that.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 10:43
“I can't find a better example of Brown's personal lawyer telling a court that people shouldn't expect manifestos to actually mean anything” Are you a fan of the Sun ? you could work for the tabloids.

“if manifesto promises aren't important” another re-write, you are doing well here.

“but when someone implies I'm a Nazi” and another one !

A quite substantial blend of half truths and subjective bias based on nothing significant. If you are going to pontificate in this way you need to find something more important.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 11:19

What has any of this guff got to do with the subject matter ?

Nick said...

In response to your first point, here's why I said in my last post: “I can't find a better example of Brown's personal lawyer telling a court that people shouldn't expect manifestos to actually mean anything”. You seem to have an issue with this so, again, here's what Brown's personal lawyer said in an open court: "Manifesto pledges are not subject to legitimate expectation." Translation from legalese: "The electorate have no right to expect manifesto pledges to be enacted."

I think you may have misunderstood what I meant by 'better'. I meant 'more clear'. I have no idea what this has to do with what paper I do or do not read.

For your second point, you've taken half a line and quoted it out of context. Here's what I said: “if manifesto promises aren't important, they're just another piece of marketing flim-flam”. If promises made in manifestos are not subject to legitimate expectation, they are simply strap-lines for a branding campaign. L'Oreal makes hair shiny, Labour fights poverty, Tories cut taxes, the SNP liberate Scotland from the yoke of English opression and so on. If there's no onus on the party to deliver, what's the point?

Lastly, you said: "Are you some kind of Nazi or something?" That statement implies you might consider what I wrote to be fascistic. Seeing as our only exchanges we've had come from these threads, it seems reasonable to assume that's the view you've formed of me and are happy to present to other readers. You disagree? Please explain why.

Or feel free to respond to this: if we have no right to expect political parties to act on their pledges, what tangible things are we voting for in elections?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 14:36

You have made a fool of yourself and now we are expected to read this, you haven’t said anything new, maybe you are not so clever as you clearly think. (30 words) try it.

Nick said...

1. What's the point in manifesto pledges if politicians have no responsibility to enact them?

2. Why did you use the word ‘Nazi’ in response to my post?

Words? 30.

Macnasty said...

Kelly @ 6.14
Kelly, you deranged Muppet, what has America got to do with Labour policies leaving record numbers homeless?

According to you, 'Labour housed more people etc.'

Labour has now 'unhoused' more people than any other government, so I guess this balances things out in your purblind view.

Rumbold said...

Terry:

I never watched Dallas. But I shall try and think of other popular programmes that could fit into your world view. Any ideas?

Anonymous said...

Terry,
Why don't you engage with Nick's arguments rather than merely insulting and dismissing him?
It does seem to be your default modus operandi when faced with difficult questions.
P.S. It seems all the candidates for the 'Leader of the Labour Group in Scotland' support abolition of the council tax as it now stands.
Were they too shy to speak up before now?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 11/08/08

1/ Stupid question.
2/ Using the law against someone for breaking a manifesto promise is totalitarian and fascistic i.e. Nazi.

If you can’t make any sense any amount of words is too many.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Macnasty) 11/08/08

I was trying to get you to think about the political system, OK I admit it, it was silly of me, trying to get you to think I mean.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Rumbold) 11/08/08
As they say on “chewin the fat” you’ve taken this too far.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 14:18
I have engaged with his arguments, it’s hardly by fault if you are not able to keep up is it ?

All 3 don’t agree with abolition and they have been discussing tax systems for ever, politicians always do that, you seem to be a bit slow on this.

Nick said...

Why is it a stupid question? Are you saying we just have to take it on good faith that politicians will deliver what they say they will?

Ok, so you interpret the possibility of binding a body elected by the voting public into some sort of covenant to do what they promised in order to win votes totalitarian? Funny, I'd say ID cards, centralised databases and detention without trial was totalitarian.

And just to clarify, totalitarian doesn't immediately mean fascist or Nazi. It could mean communist, Stalinist and more. I don't see that what I've said leads to the gas chambers or the gulag, so I'd like you to withdraw the Nazi comment please.

Nick said...

A quick note to clarify...

Totalitarianism is defined as a political system in which the state regulates nearly every aspect of public and private life.

How does protecting the electorate from governments wishing to weasel out of manifesto commitments fit into that?

Anonymous said...

Councillor Terry Kelly, as an MP surely you have to at least pretend to engage with voters. Some posts here have highlighted very fair points which you have twisted or deliberately failed to understand. Why? If anything you are only exposing your general ignorance and inability to answer a simple question. Why not be polite like your posters instead of making ridiculous accusations of fascism?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 09:03

It’s a stupid question because I said it’s a stupid question, that’s my opinion.

“I'd say ID cards, centralised databases and detention without trial was totalitarian” didn’t take you long to digress did it ? That looks like game set and match to me.

Totalitarian can mean many things, in this instance I regard it as Nazi, if you admit that you are a devious liar who is trying to change the subject because you have lost I’ll withdraw the word Nazi, OK ?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 09:16

You digress further, you are not just a bad loser you are a spectacularly bad loser, read my last answer to you.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 11:05

I have engaged with those who have written to me just like I’m doing now with you and I consider you to be a devious liar, it’s just a feeling I have, maybe you will prove me wrong by identifying yourself and we will see where you are coming from. The argument is weak and not trustworthy when it is anonymous.

Nick said...

'Devious liar'? More ad hominem...

Your answer to my question isn't an answer, it's a dismissal. If you disagree, why won't you give a reasoned argument?

I wasn't digressing, merely giving examples of what I would consider to be totalitarian policies. You disagree that these measures are totalitarian?

Why would you regard what I've said as 'Nazi'? Wouldn't 'totalitarian' on its own have done? I don't believe the Nazis ever passed a law binding themselves to manifesto promises. Where are the similarities? It's quite specific (and emotively charged) slur.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 18:51
You protest too much you have lost this, that’s why you are desperately dragging in all kinds of red herrings, have another go and learn from this.

kennedy said...

Some jumped up councillor on a wee blog who reckons that this tired and corny rhetoric is going to have people queuing to vote Labour...........

The Scottish Government are popular and Scots believe that they are acting in their best interest, something Labour and their cosy unionist bum chums the liberals never managed to do with a voting monopoly in the Scottish parliament due to their coalition.

As for manifesto commitments, plenty have been adhered to and others are yet to come to fruition-we are a year and a half into this session of Government you see.

One thing is for sure, the moment Labour and liberal amateur hour participants formed a coalition, they ripped up their manifestos so that they could crawl to each other and simultaneously (metaphorically speaking) shaft the other parties.

They did nothing for Scotland, they said that they were competent, and the media backed them up (still do to an extent but Scottish voters aren't listening) but like Westminster we have witnessed the exact opposite of what a competent government should have been doing.

Ever since Scots realised that the Daily record was only worth it for the sport, and ignored their rather kindergarten 'vote Labour" approach to Scottish politics, the who country has moved on for the better.

If i was a Labour councillor, I would do my utmost to make Labour electable, and simply talking a load of tired and aimless mince about the Scotish Government isn't going to produce a Labour comeback.

they will be out in Westminster, and there will not be some 'fighting fifty' bunch of 'Scottish' Labour gravy train merchants basking in the light of Westminster until that boring unioninist cycle comes around-in fact the chances of Labour being a force in these Isles will be seriously affected by the seats that they will lose in the next UK election.

That Labour humpty dumpty may never get put back together again, and I for one, after witnessing their childish political rhetoric, their warmongering ways on third world sovereign countries, their nuclear proliferation, their stealth taxes and of course their economic mismanagement-will be glad to close the door of Scotland on Labour until they learn to do what the voters want, not what their London leaders tell them.

Especially they need to get away from allowing rent a mouths like Andy Kerr to set their cause back by gagging his vacuous commentary-like wee Dougie Alexander, that guy looks ready to burst into tears when he has somebody there to give a retort back rather than just his rent a quote in isolation.

Andy Kerr should remember that as 'Scottish" health minister he shut down and moved services based on what has been discovered as "flawed analysis and outdated data"-so St John's in Livingston West Lothian, the fastest growing population in Scotland, had her services moved to prop up the PFI Royal in Edinburgh.

That deal was done and dusted, but at least a far more capable and competent Scottish Government reversed the other decisions for the very reasons I gave in quotation.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(kennedy) 12:58

You should try running some of this garbage past the people of Renfrewshire where we are suffering the consequences of an SNP / Lib. Dem. coalition ! Do you ever feel stupid Mr. Anonymous ?

Tell it to the schoolchildren, their parents, their teachers, tell it to the elderly who have been subjected to crippling costs by the SNP/ Lib. Dems. Or those who have lost their Libraries, their housing area offices, try the kids who have lost the ice rink etc. etc. etc.

I could go on and there is lots more of this to come as the SNP continue to betray the people of Renfrewshire - What Salmond (the spiv) and his treacherous party want is a Tory Govt. think on that ! They are traitors to Scotland.